The GREEN won’t budge. - One dye job, 7 questions. Bleaching Out the Green, Bleaching roots or ends first, bleaching damp hair, green making purple muddy, colors that cover green, Toner before direct dye, how to prevent bleeding in multicolor direct dye.

Okay. So, the YouTube video I referred to is at this link.

https://youtu.be/rxgDNbtChgs

I’m case the link doesn’t work. It’s “Free Salon Education”. The video is titled: HOW TO COLOR HAIR WHITE -WHITE HAIR COLOR TUTORIAL.” He is using a technique that he learned from @hairlikeaboss

The Colors that I have right now in direct dyes are: (Note: the Perfect Intensity is the same as the One N Only Argan dye. They changed the box ?.) - Perfect Intensity Scarlet Red - Arctic Fox Sunset Orange – Arctic fox cosmic sunshine – manic panic electric banana – Ion color brilliance Jade (THATS what is stuck in my hair!) – BTZ color jams tripped up turquoise (actually for my daughter. Doesn’t look good on me unless I mix it with something.) - arctic fox periwinkle – Ioncolor brilliance sky blue – perfect intensity midnight blue -perfect intensity pastel lili – Perfect intensity pure purple - ion color brilliance purple - ion color brilliance radiant orchid - ion color brilliance fuchsia – perfect intensity pastel bubblegum – splat midnight amethyst - manic panic virgin snow (I don’t even know how I got that. It’s probably old as the hills.)

This was the when the jade went in the first time. It got messed up because I was trying to do a color melt like the inspiration photo. Then, the fix, with good outcome.

Rainbeauxs4kandy wrote: This was the when the jade went in the first time. It got messed up because I was trying to do a color melt like the inspiration photo. Then, the fix, with good outcome.

Finally, the inspiration photos for what I am trying to acheive this time around. NONE OF THESE ARE MINE.

Lastly, the dip dye inspiration.....

So, I have over 140 photos OF ME, since 2016, dealing with this green mess. And every change in between. From stripping it out (trying to) to the muddy purple.

If you need more to look at to see what I’m working with here, just ask. Some day, I’ll get them on my hair timeline. I have photos going back to 1996 that I’ve been moving to a folder called hair crazy timeline. Lol.

I’m just really sick of this GREEN hanging around.

Thanks to anyone who responds. Kandy

I'm going to try to answer your questions one-by-one, but I just wanted to mention that your goal is going to be tricky to pull off because Ion Jade is really sticky and you really need to get it out for some particular parts of your look. The two things I'd encourage if you really want exactly what you've described is to 1) strand test when you're unsure of the outcome and 2) not to push forward and assume things will even themselves out. I'm sure you know that already, but I know sometimes, people get frustrated or impatient in a multi-step process and just move forward and create more of a headache for themselves later.

1 - The only areas where you really, really need to lift the green are any areas you want to do an orange or yellow in and the lighter areas with the lavender/periwinkle. Orange and yellow won't cover the green and will turn out muddy. The lavender/periwinkle need a lighter base that what you have now, but if you have a touch of minty green left over, they'll be okay. You just need to make sure you also lift the base. There are some reds that can pull a decent-looking burgundy over faded green that won't necessarily be as bright but will look lovely mixed in with a rainbow. Purple, blues, and greens should do fine. Pink is kind of on the edge, because it might pull more cool-toned and closer to a purple, but I think it'll be fine. Now, I personally don't find bleach that amazing at getting out green, so I'd highly recommend the strand test first to see if you can even get what you need out. Otherwise, you may need to rethink the rainbow portions.

2 - I'd do roots first then green. I'm not sure how much experience you have with bleaching your own hair, but I think you'll have a easier time concentrating on the roots first, then maybe brushing the excess bleach through the green for the last 5-10 minutes to see what you can get out because you go in with the targeted bleach for the green. This has two benefits. Number one, if things turn out well and you can get enough lift from your roots to get the green out of the areas you need to, you don't need to be damaging your ends more on the second process. Number two, if you end up missing some spots on your roots, you can touch them up during the second process. If you do things in reverse, the best case scenario is that the green all comes out flawlessly, but now you still have to worry about overprocessing your ends when you do your roots.

3 - Now, I personally do not like shampooing/clarifying my hair before bleaching, because I like having my scalp greasy to protect it from the bleach. My hair is black, so I have to do two processes with really strong mixes, so I just can't handle that if I start with a clean scalp. If sensitivity isn't an issue for you, you might be able to do that, but I'd do a patch test to confirm. That said, I don't think there's anything wrong with just dampening with water. It does make the bleach glide on more smoothly, but just be careful that's it not too wet so you don't get dripping. You might have to adjust the timing a bit, but a strand test should be able to help you gauge that.

4 - If it turned out well initially, I think the problem was just dye build-up over time. You can dilute semi-permanent dyes with condition and use that for touch-ups to reduce build-up. One thing to be careful about when removing purple is that it bleaches out to green, so if that's how you removed it, you may also have some more residual staining from that in addition to the original green stain.

5 - I mentioned in the answer to the first question, but reds, magenta pinks, blue, green, and purples should all work decently. It's just warm tones like yellow and orange that might pose an issue.

6 - Toner probably won't do anything positive for longevity. If you use a semi-permanent toner that doesn't require developer, it won't really make a difference. If you use something that uses developer, it runs the risk of damaging your hair too much and making it more difficult for colours to stick to your hair. For direct dyes, I personally feel like toning is just an extra step that isn't necessary. Usually, if you can just compensate by mixing your colours differently. For example, if I'm worried that blue will look too green over a yellow base, I just add in a little bit of purple. It's basically the same principle as toning, but you do it in one step, instead of two. With the green, it's a little too dark for toning to help, especially with what your end goal is. If you can lift it to a light minty green, I think you'll mostly be okay, but I just don't think toner will do anything extra to help, unless you use something with high ammonia content does a better job of getting the green out than bleach. Still, that's not really the toner working as much as just the lightening component in the toner. At the end of the day, I'd just plan not to use any toner unless it's an extreme last resort to try to get some green out.

7 - The hardest parts of this to me will be the two rainbows. There's really no fool-proof method of avoiding bleeding, but I'll list all the tips I know. So, generally, the thing you're going to have the most trouble with is the yellow. Yellow loves to pick up tints of other colours and it's very likely that it'll stain green over time, since green is the colour next to it on the rainbow. It's not the end of the world, but when you're doing the application, I'd leave double the space for the yellow. For example, if all your other colours are 1cm wide, paint on a 2cm band for the yellow to compensate for any staining from nearby colours. You can always go over it to blend it in with the orange and green later if it looks weird. The second main thing you can do is to heavily coat any portions you don't want to get dye on with conditioner or body butter or anything that helps prevent dye from absorbing and pin those areas up, if possible, also keep those areas clipped up as you rinse out the other colours, so you don't have to go back in and re-section them again later. This is going to be tricky with some of your placements, so I'm going to go over how I'd approach your dye job a little later. Now, the most important thing you can do is to make sure that you dilute your dyes to just the strength you need to cover your base and really rub them into your hair. Depending on what dyes you use, this might mean diluting them 1:1 or more with conditioner before you apply them to the hair. As you rub the dye into your hair with your fingers, the conditioner base should start separating from the dye and it'll start looking white-ish or like a soft pastel version of the colour. Wipe this off and then keep applying as needed. You also want to put the minimum amount of dye you need onto an area. Basically just dip your tint brush in and then wipe off the excess on the edge of the bowl so just you have the thinnest possible coating of dye on it. You'll probably need to build up your layers more this way, but it helps minimize the amount of run-off when you rinse out your hair, which helps keep the colours from staining each other.

Now, I'm going to go over how I'd approach your colour scheme. I don't do all of these things every time I do a multi-coloured look, but this is just what I think the safest path is if you really want to minimize the risk of the colours running into each other. First, I'd section off the front regions that you want to be periwinkle/lavender, and coat with them conditioner/body butter before tying them up securely with pins/ties/clips. I'd also do the same with the hidden rainbow section. Now, you want these sections to be secure enough that you can rinse the rest of your hair without them coming undone. It will be tricky if they're a bit slippery from the conditioner, so experiment with how you'll do this before you start dyeing. Then, I'd start the application of the purple with the rainbow ends. The reason you're not doing the ends separately is that it's very likely that the purple will bleed into the ends when you rinse and then they'll just be too dark to do the other colours. Apply as I described before: diluted dyes, building up layers with minimum amount on the brush, rubbing the dye in to make sure it's well-absorbed. You don't want your hair even to be dripping with dye. Then, you let it process, covered so it doesn't dry out, and when you rinse it out, I'd leave those sectioned areas for the periwinkle and hidden rainbow tied up to avoid as much bleeding onto those regions as possible. As you rinse, the purple will start running into the rainbow ends, but since you used a minimal amount of dye, it shouldn't disrupt the colours too much. Rinse until the water runs as close to clear as you can get it. When you're done pat your hair dry, still leaving those sections up until you're ready to dye them. If you do them on a separate day, you don't have to keep them up tied up the whole time, but it's just helpful, because you don't have to go back and try to pick out the exact same section as before. When you're ready to do the periwinkle and hidden rainbow, just do the same application style as before. You can do these at the same time or separately, whatever makes you more comfortable. When you rinse, try to target. just those areas to avoid as much of the surrounding purple as you can. If you have a sink with a hand-held sprayer, it may be helpful for this. If you have to just use the shower, it won't be the end of the world if you rinse all of your hair at once, so don't fret over this too much.

I've rambled on a lot here, so please feel free to ask any additional questions if you need more clarification on anything.

Hair crazy RESPONSE

Omg. THANK YOU. YOU ARE AMAZING.

So, Update : Friday. I got so upset that I gave up and started messaging stylists. I’ve been communicating with TWO who ...... I don’t know what to do at this point.

So I’m going to break up my response into separate “replies”. Cus I have more questions. I’ll go in the following order.....

• 1. Conversation 1- Do I trust a stylist who isn’t willing to push the limits with me? But, IS kinda pushy?
• 1. Conversation 2- Do I trust a stylist who is somewhat (understandably all things considered, but still if you can’t handle me and my disabilities via message, how the heck will you treat me in your chair?) rude, impatient, and doesn’t want to hear my hair HISTORY? But, if they say they CAN do it???
• 1. Do I bravely press on on my own? If so, see my LAST reply today, and see what you think about my thoughts on moving forward. And response/questions to the lovely that responded already.

Last comments before I move on to the separate replies.

Also, check out this YouTube video. https://youtu.be/bSsx7dOSsts

I watched it, and thought “OMG. Those stylists worked SO HARD AND LONG FOR HER AND I NEED SOMEONE WHO IS WILLING TO WORK THAT HARD FOR ME!” That’s when I started messaging salons. To cut through the crap, no. She doesn’t say how much she paid. However, I might not be able to afford $2000 for a hair dye, but I’d be willing to pay more than $500-700. (Yeah. My husband just got income taxes and said if I want it spent on my hair, so be it. Im not rolling in dough. Just every now and then, we have a little extra. I’ve been married 23 years. My husband KNOWS how important my hair is.) I’m NOT asking people to work for me and not be paid fairly. And if they do an amazing job, I’ll pay extra!!!! So, don’t think I’m just a cheapskate. Over the last 4 months, alone, I’ve spent several hundred (I don’t handle our families finances because I have bipolar disorder and screw shtuff up sometimes. So, I got a monthly “allowance”. Guilt free, I know I’m not messing up finances, it’s direct deposited from my husbands paycheck to a separate bank account that is just MINE, money that I can spend on whatever I want, money. Usually. I buy stuff for other people. But, I just restocked my color supplies and since I just did my 13-year old, going through summer of Covid, childs hair for the first time ever, I went a little extra. I even bought a freaking portable salon bowl!!!! Not for me. I’ve been washing my hair upside down since 1995!!! But, for my kiddo? Yeah. Why not? You can check that link out here.

Height Adjustable Portable Salon Deep Shampoo Basin Sink Hair Treatment Bowl with Drain Hose- Black https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01K4IA21Y/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_sx80Eb4G9G9BJ

Not affiliated. Just sharing. Not the BEST in the world. But, it gets the JOB done.

So...... I’m going to post each conversation below separately. Why? Not to call them out. For sure. I know they are doing what THEY EACH DO BEST. We all have strengths.

Dyehards, and haircrazies, we know that professionals would often rather leave a client like us unhappy than risk a lawsuit on judge Judy if our hair falls off.

I don’t live in an area with the hugest selection of REALLY TALENTED PROFESSIONAL FASHION COLOR AMAZING MAGIC WORKING HAIR WIZARDS!!! And that’s basically what I’m looking for. I am looking for a local Guy Tang, Brad Mondo, ElleBangs, Caitlin Ford, and ALA AISLINN, the list goes ON ..... I’m just citing ones most people know but I’m obsessed with all the pros. I live just outside [edited] HOW DO I FIND California, New York, Las Vegas, Paris LEVEL Pros, HERE? We don’t have a wide selection. With Covid, that selection is even SMALLER. I would LOVE to find a person that I could confidently trust with my hair, KNOWING they will not just give up or stop at the, safe line, just because they don’t want to get bad reviews, have an up happy client, or go to court. When I put my hair in someone else’s hands, I want them to treat it exactly how I would, safest route possible, with accurate knowledge, think outside of the box, truly passionate about vivid colors, I afraid to be BOLD, and willing to take certain risks with smart and careful attention to detail. In the end, hair DOES grow back. So, I’m not afraid to push it. I realize it’s risky sometimes. But, if IM WILLING to try, I want my stylist to be willing to go with me. Not stop at the line. If I had someone like THAT, I’d never do my hair BY MYSELF AGAIN. Cuz. Who WOULD? If you could afford the cost, and knew you were sharing a brain with your stylist, wouldn’t you rather lean back and let THEM DO IT, instead of holding your own arms above your head for hours, and wishing you could find some Olaplex, and not being able to see the back of your own head? I’d rather relax and stuff. But, not if you are going to not work for the money I WILL PAY YOU to do what I want. Right?

Look, I did actually go through SOME cosmetology school. I got through the HAIR classes and half way through the manicure and pedicure part, before I had to move away. I couldn’t afford to go back. I ended up stumbling into another career that became my passion.

So, no I’m NOT a professional. And I took that course in 2001. But, I also PASSED THOSE CLASSES WITH FLYING COLORS (pun intended.)!!! Science doesn’t change that much and I do my danged research!!! However, I’m still NOT a pro. Meaning there are some things I can’t get my hands on. Anyone wanna help me get my hands on real Olaplex number 1 and 2? Sigh. Just chucking that out there. And it’s STILL hard as crap sometimes to actually DO your OWN HEAD. Especially having developed arthritis. So.....

If I haven’t mentioned, I am disabled and have several disorders that cause me issues. Affecting my hair “issues” at current....... - Agoraphobia - Germaphobia (Covid. And I am immune compromised) - Social anxiety - Panic Disorder (YES. IM PANICKING ABOUT MY HAIR. I doubt there is anyone who has a hair timeline, or regularly posts or even just lurks and reads like I typically do, that would NOT panic about this even without panic disorder. So..... yeah! I always try to be upfront and open with this. And sometimes, I say really dumb things!!!) - Hypergraphia

Now, next post/reply thingy.

Okay. I didn’t get back to this yesterday. Was applying color to childs hair, for the summer.

Conversation 1:

This Stylist has been doing my middle childs hair for the last six months....

They told me to stop rambling and just tell her what I used to “achieve the green”! I kinda wanted to scream because firstly.....I DIDN'T TRY TO ACHIEVE THIS. But, semantics. I let it go. However, THIS IS NOT A ONE DYE JOB GONE WRONG. This is ..... here. I’ll post the conversation...

This was the conversation yesterday. It left me with a real sour taste in my mouth.

: me - I need hair help desperately. My child comes to y’all. She was there yesterday in fact. (Sent photo of pink haired child she sent me while sitting in stylist chair.) That’s her. I am DESPERATE. I have a STUCK gross green in my hair and I can’t get it out. I’ve been trying off and on since 2016. I need some REAL TALENTED COLOR CORRECTION.

: stylist - Can you send me a picture of what your hair looks like?

I did so..... and : Me - That was a couple days ago. I have a folder of my entire hair history for as far back as I starting dying it again in ...... many years ago. But, I’m real careful. Also I document my hair history the best I can.

: Stylist - Was this done at home or in a salon?

: me - I did it. Which is why I can tell you everything I did.

: Stylist - What did you use to put it in? And what have you used to try to take it out?

: Me - With photos. I even have a hair crazy profile. ? I can tell you everything but it a lot. At least since it got STUCK. Because I stopped dying it for about 5 years and grew out every bit of dye and cut it off until there was nothing but virgin hair.

It’ll be one of those “hair transformation videos” if you can fix my hair. I don’t know how to fix it. I have tried everything but carefully. Sorry. It’s just a LONG LONG STORY. To text for sure.

Goodness. I’m sorry. It’s the time of day I sometimes have panic attacks more often. I woke up in one today. I write out this whole thing in relevant places. But, I’m not very organized. And it’s all in pieces and you are the first person. Who messaged me back. Except this other person. I’m sorry. Can I get back with you in a bit? I need to talk to Lucy and my husband. I will send you information as I gather it, and remember how to stop physically holding my breath on accident...... I’m so sorry. Lol. Cheese and rice. (That’s what I say instead of Jesus.)

I’m not supposed to keep typing when I’m having a panic attack. So um. I’ll be back. Sorry.

I’m a really honest person. Also I’m. I have mental disorders. But I am not a bad person. I can be fun. And um. Oh my. I’m sending you my self affirmations. Lol.

The WORLD, yeah? You ladies make my child feel like the best thing in the world. I’m not even kidding. Just saying.

Whew. And I’m back. So sorry about that.

I took the wrong times meds. Lol. Look. I’m legit crazy. But I’m also really nice. Here’s more photos.

Sorry. Was watching NASA with my 13 year old.

This is one of the emails I have sent to other stylists.

“NOW, I have a problem. Actually, it’s been a problem since 2016. I have this HORRID green stuck in my hair. I have tried everything. And I mean, EVERYTHING to get it out. It started with the Jade color from the Ion Color Brillance Semi-permanent line. (Why do we not use brand new lines of dye? Because THIS. That’s why. Regret!!!) I’ve been dealing with it by using a FABULOUS purple. I love it. But, as a person with “fashion color hair life”, as a stylist, you know we get sick of things right? I still like the purple. But, I’m .... jeez. I’m going through “life changes” and “Covid” too.

And I NEED NEW HAIR. I have inspiration photos and I know almost exactly what I want. After being disabled and not working since 2012, I’ve finally accepted the fact that I will likely not ever work for an actual employer again. That sucks for me, because I was good at my job, passionate about it, and it hurts that I have to let that go.

But, there’s always a silver lining. Or in my case, a rainbow. Not working anymore, actually means...... I CAN DO WHATEVER I WANT WITH MY HAIR BECAUSE I NEVER HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT FOLLOWING A DRESS CODE EVER AGAIN!!!! YAYYY!!!

So, I’m ready for a pretty drastic change. ???

But, I’m in TEARS. I have tried everything. Luckily, my new hair goals, involve cutting considerable length from the right side of my hair, so I have been taking swatches from that side well below where I am going to cut, and using those to try and try and try to get the green out.

I’ve tried multiple bleachings at every level of developer, for over an hour under heat, (no I would never do that on my head.) from several different brands, color removers, beer (we don’t even drink beer, I went to the gas station and bought myself a beer to put on a test strand.). I’ve done the vitamin c, the dawn, the dandruff shampoo, the bleach caps, epsom salt, hot oil, color theory, ketchup, plain white vinegar, baking soda, toners, actual permanent hair colors like Wella T18, Clairol, L’Oreal, One N Only, in High lift blonds and mulitple other colors to try to counteract the green and get it to a “workable color” and EVERYTHING else I have EVER used or read about, or seen.

I’ve been at this, THIS TIME, for almost three months. Sometimes, I think “oh my god! I think this is working!!!” And then, nope. I have even gotten it platinum white and soon as I rinsed it, the green came BACK.....and then, I started using SCIENCE to come up with stuff I have never even heard of.

FYI- I’ve finally found something magic eraser WONT work on and  denture tablets, hot water, and 45 minutes DISSOLVES HAIR. Like, you could maybe dissolve a BODY WITH IT!!! That’s SCARY!!!

Anyway, I’ve been working on this for hours almost every other day since March 3rd. I was about to give up and message you, when Covid shut down the schools. So, I’ve been trying ever since before and all through Covid.

Now, that I have seen that some salons are starting to be open, I’ve messaged the ones I have seen “near me”. (Completely forgetting about you because you AREN'T near me. Sorry. But, if you will take me, I will make the drive.) I’ve messaged five so far. This week. They are: closed, not replying, not taking appts for new clients or they look at my photos and say “I’m pretty sure I can’t do that.”

My husband has told me multiple times, to find a salon. And I’ve told HIM multiple times, that this is GOING TO COST A FORTUNE! I even told him that our middle child has been going to a salon to have her butt length hair bleached and dyed bubblegum pink.

The first time she went to this salon and came to show me in January, it was nice, but um. I fixed some stuff. But, she has a TON of super thick hair. So, not really their fault. And the touch ups are perfect. But, she only goes THERE because it is right next to her job. She said that some of the people there are “snobby”. So, I don’t want to go there.

Again, like in October,  I’ve told my husband how much it cost for my CHILDS initial visit and her root touch up and refresh color. He seems willing to pay that.

But, I’m trying to explain to him that this is a whole different LEVEL of expertise and a long trial and error process. Completely different from bleaching virgin hair and making it pink. This is color CORRECTION.

But, I can’t even get anyone to TALK to me via email, text, Facebook messenger...and so, I can’t even give him a “starting price”. But, he INSISTS that I stop cutting new strands for science experiments followed by tears and get to a salon.

So, I was looking through email, to see if I had any replies from anyone just now, and I found THIS and I haven’t seen anywhere if you are open or accepting clients.

But, if you ARE, can you PLEASE email me back so I can SHOW you my problem and also what I “want” which I know I will probably not really get but am desperately trying to get close to...... It involves the color correction, bleaching about a year or more of dark brown regrowth that is completely virgin, a hair cut, and application of new colors. Multiple new colors.

I’ve been dying my own hair since I was 16 years old and I’m 40 now. I have NEVER EVER EVER had a problem like this. But, I HAVE to get it fixed.

It sounds stupid to say, but my self-esteem is really taking a hit with this, and I’m terrified to just “cover it up” again. Especially since, I don’t THINK it is, but I MAY be using a purple that fades to green. But, I’m not sure because ALL of my hair ISNT GREEN. Just where that dumb jade was. And the worst part is that aqua, turquoise, sea foam, mint, blue, anything in the blue/green family, that isn’t dark, DOESNT LOOK GOOD ON ME. IT NEVER HAS. It’s the worst possible color I could get stuck in my hair. Only looks good when mixed in with others colors. And even then, it’s iffy.

Do note: again, I did NOT do all this science on my HEAD. The only things I’ve done to my HEAD, since I messaged you In October are the “natural” fading methods, adding more purple till it got so dark and muddy that it just looked brown/black and ONE packet of Joico color remover. Which I did NOT like and it did NOTHING. My hair that’s still on my HEAD, is healthy and except for split ends that need a trim. I’m not in any super huge rush. No wedding to go to this time. So, I could wait till you have an appt time. But, I’m afraid I don’t know how much time it will take. I could be there and done in 2 hours because you work magic or it could take two days. I just don’t know. ?

I understand completely that this would normally require a full consult. However, as I said in my previous emails, I have agoraphobia and social anxiety. I ALSO have severe germaphobia. I would MUCH RATHER not have to leave my house TWICE. For a consult and THEN, a visit. But, I will if I ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO.

I haven’t left my house since the first day I heard Covid could POSSIBLY be in the US. I do have an immunocompromising condition, however it isn’t as severe as others. I have protective gear and I will do everything in my own power to protect myself and YOU. I have not had ANY contact with ANYONE other than my 13 year old who has been in full lockdown with me and my husband who is “essential” but under VERY stringent standards and rotates out being in the office every two weeks. I still make him stand at the front door and go through a complete, OCD, paranoid, 45 minute decontamination process every day after work. He basically bathed in the living room with pure rubbing alcohol and soaks his clothes with Lysol spray and then goes and outs them in the washer before processing to the shower.

I have not even seen my other children or gone to the drive by and wave birthday parade for my grandchildren’s first birthday. I have only been outside in my own yard to walk around in circles to get some sun, and I have RUN all the way across my rather large yard, away from my own front door (on video, like an idiot) twice when I was outside and a delivery person has shown up. I am probably the most unlikely person to have been exposed that you will find. Even my doctor visits have moved to video. Which is VERY VERY unsettling. Because I don’t do phone and video stuff. Anyway. I hope this reaches you and I hope you are your loved ones are doing well and you are all healthy. Crossing my fingers that you can find some way to help me.

Sincerely, [Edited for privacy]

(YES, I KNOW IT WAS LONG. YES. I HAD A DAMNED PANIC ATTACK IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS COMMUNICATION. YES. I HAVE HYPERGRAPHIA. I CANT HELP IT. I TRY MY BEST. I KNOW SHE IS SLAMMED. BUT, I WOULD HAVE RATHERED SHE WAITED TO RESPOND THAN TO RESPOND HOW SHE DID. BUT, IN THE END, IM MORE THAN A LITTLE OVERSENSITIVE ABOUT PEOPLE CUTTING ME OFF IN MED-COMMUNICATION. WHY? BECAUSE EVERYONE DOES IT. INCLUDING MY KIDS AND HUSBAND. ITS FRUSTRATING. FOR EVERYONE!)

: Stylist - We have been chaotic busy. I cannot read all that. Can you just tell me in short what you put in your hair and what you used to try to get it out?

Did you bleach it with at home bleach and use at home color to achieve the green?

: Me - Multiple colors since 2016. Mostly purple. But. Some greens and blues. I’ve used ion color brilliance, and one n only perfect intensity. I never use box dyes or bleaches. I used salon care blue flash in 20 volume over the years. I’ve only done non bleach remover and fading methods since I think before last August. Except for a packet of Joico’s color remover but I couldn’t leave it in as long as it said to. It smelled and acted just like bleach and did lighten some of my regrowth I got it on. I didn’t want to bleach me hair and when I saw it was a thing like bleach I eased it out. Everything else I e been trying on test strands.

I also apologize for the length. I have a condition that actually makes me write too too much. I try to rein it in. But, it’s hard to.

Nothing back from this stylist since Saturday. I also didn’t mean to include my whole email signature in that copy/paste I sent her from my email. But, it was an accidental oops.

Conversation 2 -

I already wrote the email I sent her in the conversation above. I have spoken with her a couple times preveiois to this email to ask her about an appt back in October for a wedding I was going to. (NIGHTMARE. Not the conversation or the wedding. Just my social anxiety killing me during the whole event.)

This was her response to my email that I sent her that is copied/pasted to the above conversation, with following emails.

: Stylist: Hi Chrys! It sounds like you definitely could use a knowledgable color specialist at this point. You would absolutely have to come for the initial consultation. On average, corrective color is $100 per hour. Please send some photos of your hair currently. I can't promise, but maybe I can give you an idea of what it will take to correct your hair by looking at the photos. Also, send your inspiration picture as well. Also, are you willing to let go of fun fashion colors if we can get your hair where it needs to be to get healthy? Also, something to consider, I am NOT willing to get your hair in a great place and then have you "take over" yourself for a while and then you seek me out again. IF I can work with you, its all or nothing. Does that make sense? I'll be back to the salon on Tuesday to check emails. Have a great weekend!

: Me - Okay. I understand your position on all that. Here’s photos of my hair yesterday. And some of my poor strand tests hairs. I’m not really okay with any natural color except reds. I hate my natural color and I’m starting to go Grey. Blonde is to hard to maintain and makes my face look red and blotchy. I don’t like brown. I refuse to ever ever ever put anything darker than my natural hair. So no to black. Any shade of black ever. I can pull off almost any red shade. It makes my complexion look great. It’s the only “natural color” that looks right on me. Sometimes, it can be TOO orange. But.....??‍♀️  Except that I have spent all the years that I worked or wasn’t  dying My hair at all as a red head. I’m way over it. The crazy colors are kind of my “thing”. Soooo....... not REALLY, but, I do understand that anything can go wrong or not right here. I like changing my hair when I’m ready. I don’t do it as often as most people do. The purple and then the little streak of blue I did in October, followed by more purple has been my thing since October of 2017. I spend a long time deciding what I want next and I rarely actually even wash my hair. When I finally figure out what I want to do next, and I acheive that, I will keep it for a long time. But, at this point in my life, I’m absolutely in a reinvent myself space and I’m about to get some new tattoos and peircings to go along with these things. Part of my letting go off being able to work outside of the home and moving into my next chapter of life..... so. I’m really probably not going to be happy with a natural color. No matter how good is looks. I absolutely get that you will want to be my colorist full time. That makes sense. The way I see it, when you get someone good, you stay with them. I’ve been with my Dr. for over a decade despite some issues now and then became he KNOWS my body and how I work and what my medical history is. It would be a nightmare to find a new doctor who knows my history and is compatible with my personality and the way I view my role in my healthcare. We are a team. I see hair the same way. That’s why I have always done it myself. But, as I said, my husband is tired of this. So, that would depend on several factors. IF you can do what I want and really get and keep my hairs integrity. If we agree on the products and methods of in between appointments care. If we can make a plan that extends the time between the need for appts. I am really really good and making semi-permanent colors last an eternity. We can discuss that. And I can’t STAND colors that bleed constantly. Just because my hair is a living work of art doesn’t mean I want my clothes and linens to look like my hair is being murdered on them. If you will allow me to do semi permanent deposit ONLY refreshes on my hair between appts with the exact same color and product in the same color placement just to manage fading ..... and I come to you for trims, treatments, processing,  Anti-thing that CHANGES what you did, and root touch ups...., I can do that. But, every 6 weeks, I probably couldn’t do. Just cost, leaving the house that often. If I promise to NOT CHANGE anything, or do anything that would be more complicated than slapping color on, and rinsing..... like detailed sectioning and such, as long as I only add refreshed color to it, then, as long as my husband agrees with the cost, I’ll agree to do that. Plus, my arms really do not like being in the air anymore and my feet don’t like standing in front of a mirror for hours. So, even refreshers on color I might just let you handle, if it’s just flat out easier and worth the money, to save me time and stress. Id rather have fabulous hair without the work these days. It’s just never been sometimes I could afford before.

So, I guess we will just go from there. I do understand the commitment a stylist puts into color and having a client return after ruining the job you did crying “fix it....” that’s kind of insulting to the stylist. In my opinion. I’ve simply never HAD a stylist. EVER. Just how I grew up. And the early years of life when I was buying diapers and paying for three kids in school at once. Make my hair amazing so that I love it, and I’ll stay with just my one “hair doctor”. It’s fine. As long as my husband says yes and we can work out an affordable schedule and I get the best service possible.

I WILL tell you if I’m not happy with my hair though. I won’t be able to not tell you because I CRY over my hair. Lol. But, I do know all about “oh wait, this is not what I wanted but oh wow, I love it. STOPPING HERE!” Lol. I won’t leave unhappy and not give you a chance to fix it, and slink off to someone else and bad mouth you, or try to fix what I don’t like myself and then get mad it DIDNT work. There comes a point where if you want it done right, and you really want to get what you WANT, you have to let a professional handle it. I think that’s where I’m at in life. I want great, unique, hair.... time to find a pro I trust, right?

But, I CANT promise that if I don’t adore my hair after you’ve done your best, I won’t go try someone else. I don’t make promises I can’t keep. It would be unfair of me to not tell you I don’t like it but it would be unfair if you can’t do it for me to not look elsewhere. I think that’s a fair deal.

So, I’ll send you photos and plans with descriptions of what I WANT to achieve. And we can go from there.

Thank you for being willing to even talk to me. Two stylist told me they “can’t read all that”. In understand I write too much. But, I honestly can’t help it. It’s a dumb condition I have that I can’t seem to make better no matter how hard I try.

All of these photos are of the condition of my hair two days after my last dandruff and baking soda wash before I cut pieces for test strands. I didn’t do anything else to it after that. Just the test strands.

AND I SENT HER THE RELEVANT PHOTOS AND EXPLANATION OF WHAT I WANT AS LISTED ABOVE IN MY POST.

: Stylist - Chrys, You are probably going to be disappointed in this response, however this is where you are at. The only colors that you will be able to achieve at this time, are BROWN or REGULAR red, not fashion red.

: Me - Ugh. That sucks. Let me think on this. I mean. I do understand where you are coming from. Totally. That’s basic color wheel color correction. But, you are right. It’s not what I want to hear. I need to think.

So, THIS stylist 1- wants me to promise to be her client forever but also is not willing to go the extra mile with me to give me what I want.

vivienne wrote: I'm going to try to answer your questions one-by-one, but I just wanted to mention that your goal is going to be tricky to pull off because Ion Jade is really sticky and you really need to get it out for some particular parts of your look. The two things I'd encourage if you really want exactly what you've described is to 1) strand test when you're unsure of the outcome and 2) not to push forward and assume things will even themselves out. I'm sure you know that already, but I know sometimes, people get frustrated or impatient in a multi-step process and just move forward and create more of a headache for themselves later. 1 - The only areas where you really, really need to lift the green are any areas you want to do an orange or yellow in and the lighter areas with the lavender/periwinkle. Orange and yellow won't cover the green and will turn out muddy. The lavender/periwinkle need a lighter base that what you have now, but if you have a touch of minty green left over, they'll be okay. You just need to make sure you also lift the base. There are some reds that can pull a decent-looking burgundy over faded green that won't necessarily be as bright but will look lovely mixed in with a rainbow. Purple, blues, and greens should do fine. Pink is kind of on the edge, because it might pull more cool-toned and closer to a purple, but I think it'll be fine. Now, I personally don't find bleach that amazing at getting out green, so I'd highly recommend the strand test first to see if you can even get what you need out. Otherwise, you may need to rethink the rainbow portions. 2 - I'd do roots first then green. I'm not sure how much experience you have with bleaching your own hair, but I think you'll have a easier time concentrating on the roots first, then maybe brushing the excess bleach through the green for the last 5-10 minutes to see what you can get out because you go in with the targeted bleach for the green. This has two benefits. Number one, if things turn out well and you can get enough lift from your roots to get the green out of the areas you need to, you don't need to be damaging your ends more on the second process. Number two, if you end up missing some spots on your roots, you can touch them up during the second process. If you do things in reverse, the best case scenario is that the green all comes out flawlessly, but now you still have to worry about overprocessing your ends when you do your roots. 3 - Now, I personally do not like shampooing/clarifying my hair before bleaching, because I like having my scalp greasy to protect it from the bleach. My hair is black, so I have to do two processes with really strong mixes, so I just can't handle that if I start with a clean scalp. If sensitivity isn't an issue for you, you might be able to do that, but I'd do a patch test to confirm. That said, I don't think there's anything wrong with just dampening with water. It does make the bleach glide on more smoothly, but just be careful that's it not too wet so you don't get dripping. You might have to adjust the timing a bit, but a strand test should be able to help you gauge that. 4 - If it turned out well initially, I think the problem was just dye build-up over time. You can dilute semi-permanent dyes with condition and use that for touch-ups to reduce build-up. One thing to be careful about when removing purple is that it bleaches out to green, so if that's how you removed it, you may also have some more residual staining from that in addition to the original green stain. 5 - I mentioned in the answer to the first question, but reds, magenta pinks, blue, green, and purples should all work decently. It's just warm tones like yellow and orange that might pose an issue. 6 - Toner probably won't do anything positive for longevity. If you use a semi-permanent toner that doesn't require developer, it won't really make a difference. If you use something that uses developer, it runs the risk of damaging your hair too much and making it more difficult for colours to stick to your hair. For direct dyes, I personally feel like toning is just an extra step that isn't necessary. Usually, if you can just compensate by mixing your colours differently. For example, if I'm worried that blue will look too green over a yellow base, I just add in a little bit of purple. It's basically the same principle as toning, but you do it in one step, instead of two. With the green, it's a little too dark for toning to help, especially with what your end goal is. If you can lift it to a light minty green, I think you'll mostly be okay, but I just don't think toner will do anything extra to help, unless you use something with high ammonia content does a better job of getting the green out than bleach. Still, that's not really the toner working as much as just the lightening component in the toner. At the end of the day, I'd just plan not to use any toner unless it's an extreme last resort to try to get some green out. 7 - The hardest parts of this to me will be the two rainbows. There's really no fool-proof method of avoiding bleeding, but I'll list all the tips I know. So, generally, the thing you're going to have the most trouble with is the yellow. Yellow loves to pick up tints of other colours and it's very likely that it'll stain green over time, since green is the colour next to it on the rainbow. It's not the end of the world, but when you're doing the application, I'd leave double the space for the yellow. For example, if all your other colours are 1cm wide, paint on a 2cm band for the yellow to compensate for any staining from nearby colours. You can always go over it to blend it in with the orange and green later if it looks weird. The second main thing you can do is to heavily coat any portions you don't want to get dye on with conditioner or body butter or anything that helps prevent dye from absorbing and pin those areas up, if possible, also keep those areas clipped up as you rinse out the other colours, so you don't have to go back in and re-section them again later. This is going to be tricky with some of your placements, so I'm going to go over how I'd approach your dye job a little later. Now, the most important thing you can do is to make sure that you dilute your dyes to just the strength you need to cover your base and really rub them into your hair. Depending on what dyes you use, this might mean diluting them 1:1 or more with conditioner before you apply them to the hair. As you rub the dye into your hair with your fingers, the conditioner base should start separating from the dye and it'll start looking white-ish or like a soft pastel version of the colour. Wipe this off and then keep applying as needed. You also want to put the minimum amount of dye you need onto an area. Basically just dip your tint brush in and then wipe off the excess on the edge of the bowl so just you have the thinnest possible coating of dye on it. You'll probably need to build up your layers more this way, but it helps minimize the amount of run-off when you rinse out your hair, which helps keep the colours from staining each other. Now, I'm going to go over how I'd approach your colour scheme. I don't do all of these things every time I do a multi-coloured look, but this is just what I think the safest path is if you really want to minimize the risk of the colours running into each other. First, I'd section off the front regions that you want to be periwinkle/lavender, and coat with them conditioner/body butter before tying them up securely with pins/ties/clips. I'd also do the same with the hidden rainbow section. Now, you want these sections to be secure enough that you can rinse the rest of your hair without them coming undone. It will be tricky if they're a bit slippery from the conditioner, so experiment with how you'll do this before you start dyeing. Then, I'd start the application of the purple with the rainbow ends. The reason you're not doing the ends separately is that it's very likely that the purple will bleed into the ends when you rinse and then they'll just be too dark to do the other colours. Apply as I described before: diluted dyes, building up layers with minimum amount on the brush, rubbing the dye in to make sure it's well-absorbed. You don't want your hair even to be dripping with dye. Then, you let it process, covered so it doesn't dry out, and when you rinse it out, I'd leave those sectioned areas for the periwinkle and hidden rainbow tied up to avoid as much bleeding onto those regions as possible. As you rinse, the purple will start running into the rainbow ends, but since you used a minimal amount of dye, it shouldn't disrupt the colours too much. Rinse until the water runs as close to clear as you can get it. When you're done pat your hair dry, still leaving those sections up until you're ready to dye them. If you do them on a separate day, you don't have to keep them up tied up the whole time, but it's just helpful, because you don't have to go back and try to pick out the exact same section as before. When you're ready to do the periwinkle and hidden rainbow, just do the same application style as before. You can do these at the same time or separately, whatever makes you more comfortable. When you rinse, try to target. just those areas to avoid as much of the surrounding purple as you can. If you have a sink with a hand-held sprayer, it may be helpful for this. If you have to just use the shower, it won't be the end of the world if you rinse all of your hair at once, so don't fret over this too much. I've rambled on a lot here, so please feel free to ask any additional questions if you need more clarification on anything.

So, do I continue on with one of these stylists? If so, who would you trust your hair to? Or do I take the above advice and bravely continue on my own?

If I’m my own..... a couple more questions:

1- I have been using Salon Care Blue Flash Lightening Powder for years. However, it has occurred to me, that because it is intended to deposit some blue/violet to counteract brassiness, that this product may be PART OF THE PROBLEM. I am considering purchasing a buttload of the Schwarzkopf Blonde Me line of products because the product is a WHITE lift and not blue of violet or other undertones BLEACH and because it has “Bond Enforcing Keratin Restore” in it. This is probably as close to Olaplex I will get. If I go this route, I will buy the entire system, and not use other products to ensure that the keratin bond process will WORK correctly. This product is also designed for HIGH LEVEL LIFTING.

Thougjts?

Product link (again. Not affiliated. Sharing so that I can get feedback before I buy this stuff. ) Schwarzkopf BlondMe XXL Bond Enforcing Premium Lightener 9+ Dust Free Powder - 900g / 31.6 oz https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Z8CMQGM/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_UIo1EbWC751S8

Has anyone ever tried SOAKING your hair in Epsom Salts, like in the tub, or in a salon sink filled with water? I have put a mild epsom salt and coconut oil masque on my hair, it SEEMED to lighten some areas. My husband said it lightened more in the back than I realized. I’m thinking of giving this a couple more shots.

I was wondering if anyone has ever had a difference in success between crushing the orange chewable vitamin c tablets and using the WHITE POWDER VITAMIN C like at this link: It's Just - Vitamin C Powder, Food Grade, Non-GMO, Ascorbic Acid, Immune Support, Homemade Cosmetics (24oz) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B085LV7VRC/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_QNo1EbST07KJB

Has anyone tried THESE things: https://beautyhealthtips.in/best-remedies-to-remove-hair-color-from-hair/ With any success?

In effect: Should I continue trying to REMOVE COLOR and CONDITION THE CRAP out of it for a while? And just be more patient?

Or should I give up and let one of these stylists out their hands on my hair?

Viviene- thank you so much for your reply!!! I have copied it into my hair knowledge folder so that I can read and re-read it.

One question to you, do you think that slathering the pieces I don’t want purple in plain old petroleum jelly/Vaseline while dry, before I do the purple will allow for them to not be stained? I was thinking, following your advice, that the conditioner might rinse out, even in cold water. But, Vaseline kind of requires hot water and soap to remove from hair, so my thought was..... if I simply do like you said, and make sure I do the front (periwinkle) and the ends, on completely separate days, and coat the hairs that I don’t want purple with Vaseline till it’s so thick the hair can’t even breathe till I purposefully wash it off, it would really help prevent the bleeding. ????

I think because of how complex this already IS, I am going to leave out the horizontal rainbow on the short side. I KNOW I can cover the green over there with the purple. It’s seems like going through that right now, just isn’t in the realm of possibility at the moment. I’ve already got too much going on here. Maybe I can get a couple of pieces on that side light enough to cover with a cooler rather than warmer color. Even if just at the tips for a little contrast.

If I understand you correct, in the end, all I REALLY need to do is get the pieces that I want to be red, orange, or yellow, to be as light as possible. That might actually work out because the green is not on ALL of my hair. It’s really just in streaky chunks. So, if I pick out the non green ends I may be able to just get those in the warm colors, yes?

Also, I have red that when trying to cover a particular color, if you add in a few drops of the color that would CORRECT that color into whatever color you are putting in the hair, it can counteract that color while still giving you the color that you wanted before adding the CORRECTING color. So, what if I add a bit of red, to each color? Would that make an orange/yellow/pink come out that color and counteract the green? Also, what could I add to the RED to make the red look red instead of BROWN? That one is really tripping me up. Or would this not work at all?

I like the idea you gave about diluting the colors and building them up in layers until I get the color I want. If I carrying forward on my own, I will do this. And thank you for the bleaching advice as well. God I hate the root touch up process. So difficult.

I’m going to message you directly to get your thoughts on all of this. Thank you for your absolute brilliant help. I am just unsure if I should go the salon route or my way at this point. I know this is a lot to read and respond to. I thank you so much for taking the time. And thanks to anyone ELSE who chimes in.

I made some small edits to your posts just to help protect your privacy. I haven't read your most recent post fully yet, but I will get back to it as soon as I can. I did want to mention that trying a new brand of bleach may help. but just be careful with BlondMe as it's quite strong and your hair doesn't seem that dark. It may or may not help with the green, but you also don't need it be all the way to platinum. I'd get a few levels of developer (probably the 7 and the 20) and just mix for anything you need in between.

I also wanted to say that I don't think I would personally be comfortable with either of the colourists you've talked to above. The second colourist seems like they aren't super comfortable with dyeing over stained bases and may not want to overprocess your hair trying to lift the green. The first one seems like they are really busy and, honestly, I'm always a little leery about the all-or-nothing route. I think they both have understandable positions that probably work well for their clients, but I think that it's the type of thing that doesn't really work for people who enjoy changing up their own hair. I'm definitely biased as a person who's done my own hair for over a decade now, but I think that the way salons operate doesn't lend itself very well for colourful hair. They tend to use a limited number of brands, need to keep appointment slots to a few hours at most, and don't want anyone leaving their salon with "unfinished" hair. This basically means there's no real room for experimentation or anything that would require multiple days of work. I understand your family would prefer it if you could just go to a professional and be happy, but, honestly, I have found that it's really, really hard to find someone who can do something so complicated, even in bigger cities.The ones who really have a lot of experience with fashion colours tend to be extremely busy because they are usually quite active on social media, and it can be very difficult to get an appointment for something that requires multiple hours or days when they could just fill that time with multiple easier clients and get paid the same or more. The exceptions really seem to be only if you're personal friends or an influencer with enough followers that could provide advertising for the salon. If you wanted to go the professional route, I think the best move would be to ask if someone could get you to a platinum blonde (or as light as they'd be comfortable) and do the colours yourself. Be honest that your end goal is something colourful and you specifically just want their help getting your base as clean as possible for that. A lot of colourists will not accept your as a client after you tell them this, but, if you can find someone to help you (which may still be quite a difficult process), I think this would be the best middle ground for everyone. You would only need to go in for root touch-ups as necessary and it would be a quicker process for them.

I did also want to reiterate that I think that the orange and yellow sections are really the main sticking point when it comes to the green staining. If you can get some areas light enough and just stick the colours there, I think you'd be able to get closer to your goal.

Okay, in response to your third post,

1 - BlondMe is something worth trying. I mentioned it already, but I'd get a lower volume developer as it's quite harsh.

2 - Epsom salts work to an extent in my experience, but you need a really high concentration that I think is pretty bad for the skin. I usually suggest swimming in the ocean or any salty body of water instead, but that's not a great option here. I wouldn't go too hard on this strategy, because it does work, but it won't get the colour that trapped really deep under the cuticle.

3 - I personally prefer the white vitamin c powder myself. I'm not sure it's really any better than the crushed tablets, but the consistency is finer so it's easier to mix into shampoo and I feel like that makes it spread more easily. The mix I personally use is about equal parts baking soda and vitamin c mixed into dish soap and clarifying/dandruff shampoo and then rubbed into the hair and soaked for at least 20 minutes (I usually go 30-40 because I'll go something else). I have found this works better than baking soda or vitamin C alone. I don't really measure the amounts out. I just pour the two powders into my hand (it's about a full palmful together) then squeeze the shampoo/dish soap over it and mix it together. It foams up quite a bit and then I apply it to my hair and rub it in as much as I can, scrapping off the excess foam. I then go back in with a second round of the mix and rub it in again before waiting the 20+ minutes. You have more hair than me, so you might benefit from mixing more in a bowl if you go this route.

4 - I've tried most of the options you listed and I've found that most things have their limits and if you want a perfectly clean base, you will probably have to resort to bleach eventually, but you want to maximize the amount you get out before that point. When I'm fading, I start with the vitamin C/baking soda mix I described above. I do that soak in place of my normal shampooing (about twice a week) and just shower as normal. I wait until my scalp gets greasy between treatments as I find doing a lot of treatments in a short period time tends to produce diminishing results and dries out the scalp. I have tried just soaking in dish soap or dandruff shampoo as well, and they are less drying, but take out less colour as well. I will say, though, I think the most important thing is just letting it soak. At some point, even with the waiting between treatments, you won't see much colour coming out when you rinse and that's when I turn to things like bleach or Katie's fading method. You might be at that point now.

5 - I wouldn't add red to each of the colours as I think it will mostly make them more dull-looking. Colour theory is always a bit complicated to explain, but my general advice is that you should try to keep your colour mixes as simple as possible as corrective and toning colours tend to complicate things rather than make them easier. Blues/purples/greens are all cool tones and they should be fine over your current base. Red is usually saturated enough that it can withstand a bit of green or blue on the base. Orange can sometimes handle it, but it's usually goes a bit flat and yellow is lighter than all the other rainbow shades, so it's very easy to go muddy with it.

Okay. Whew. That’s a lot of information. Thank goodness you replied to me. I don’t know if it’s good or bad, but you are absolutely as insane about crazy hair as me. Lmao.

So, I read and am not going to reply directly to most at this moment. I’m still processing things and taking actual notes and putting them together in the notes on my phone in some sorta order. Lol. Everything you said makes sense. I do have questions. Thank you for editing those things out for men I have ..... issues. Lmao. Right before I logged in just now, I messaged the stylist who said red or brown. Had an idea. This is what I sent her. But, I just KNOW going this route ..... is going to be so MUCH on every level.

One thing. Everyone knows about these fading things. I mean, that they take time and repetition. I’ve not the faintest idea of how long most people’s fading process takes. But, I know this. Whatever it takes most folks, it’s taking me way longer. Because you said,

vivienne wrote: “I wait until my scalp gets greasy between treatments as I find doing a lot of treatments in a short period time tends to produce diminishing results and dries out the scalp.

So, the thing is: I RARELY wash my hair at ALL. For four reasons: 1 Duh. It keeps the color longer. Lmao. That is how I LEARNED to use crazy colors to my benefit in the other three reasons. 2- I have learned that hair in just about any “natural color” shows dirt and oil way faster than almost any semi-permanent/crazy color. I don’t know WHY. My only caveat is pastels/platinum/grey because I have never gotten my hair to those colors. But, maybe the colors just don’t show it. Maybe it’s because “damaged” colored hair soaks up more scalp oil. Maybe the semi-permanent color sitting on the top of the cuticle prevents dirt and oil from sticking as much. I don’t know. But, I know it true for my hair at least. I have been every main color out there but white. And plenty of colors in between. My hair when dyed doesn’t build up oil and dirt as fast. This sounds gross, but I can go months without washing. I condition, mask, and oil the crap out of it and I wet it soaking with a spray bottle and I use actual conditioner sometimes, and don’t rinse it out. I squeeze it dry and use various combs and bushes to distribute and dry. I do something to it daily. 3- Why did I learn to “clean my hair” out of the shower? Because taking showers/baths is extremely difficult. I’m disabled. Physically. I have a shower chair. I do shower anytime I can. 3-4 times a week, more if I have help. But, it’s very rare that I even have enough energy to do that by myself for my body, AND do my hair. Properly. As you mentioned. I have a lot of hair. When I was 17, my hair was mid calf. I know how to take care of hair. Plus I did my three siblings’ hair every day from the time I was 11, and mine and sometimes my mothers. I have three kids. They ALL have my hair. Especially my youngest. I’ll toss a photo up her of them in their longest hair and one of my favorite 15-20 minute before school hairstyles I did later. My hair is super awesome. But, it’s requires a lot to maintain and manage. I’m really glad I have the knowledge of how to maintain it that I do. Because the extra 5-15 minutes it takes just to SHAMPOO my hair one time, because it so THICK AND COARSE, is simply too much for me to do in the shower now. Even after I learned to walk again, and before I slipped into being bad to my body again. (I’m working on it), at my BEST physical ability this decade, washing my hair in the shower exhausted me. That time I took in the shower, wipe me out for the rest of the day. So, I just started wetting my hair in the shower with cool water right before I get out and cleaning and conditioning it in bed. It’s a lot less tiring. And I fall less. Lol. Falling in showers SUCKS. 4- I have severe palmar pustular psoriasis. I have to keep my hands dry as much as possible. And I am constantly applying creams,salves, balms, ointments, and COAL TAR, to my hands. I do almost everything with gloves of some sort, depending on the activity. Imagine. 20 seconds in lukewarm water, breaks your skin open, makes it peel down to raw meat like a 20th degree burn, sloughs up like dead skin when you don’t exfoliate and it rolls up under your towel when you dry off or like wet tissue paper when your hands are damp. Then when they are dry, that same skin flakes up and the skin catches on everything and snags and rips off into healthy skin. Imagine that on your palms, feet, toes, and FINGERTIPS. Imagine it getting so bad that it “disrupts the proper growth and structure of your fingernails from the bed” until they crumble or fall off completely. Now, imagine trying to do anything with those fingers. Yeah. Don’t even get me started on ocd, germaphobia, and Covid essential washing hands and sanitizer. Ha. Hahahaha. So, washing my hair is difficult because of that too.

To size it up, I’m NOT WASHING MY HAIR as much as the MOST non-hair washing, crazy colored hair person out there. That’s why I can make a single semi-permanent dye job last over a year. Without touch ups. ? It’s true. I have the photos to prove it. Lol.

So....... how many times DO you guys wash hair with each method to fade the colors? It’s going to take ME longer. Because I basically meed to be washing my hair a LOT more TIMES over a longer period to get proper fading results. So, if you say you do a week of washing with something.... how many average TIMES, and how much rounds each time did you wash your hair with that process? I’ll have to do it that many times. I also can’t judge how long to wait between washes by how greasy my scalp gets. It DOESNT. It’s adjusted to produce less oil based on how little I wash it I think.

Also, I did not ever think about how you said you foam it up, and wipe it off and keep doing that till no more color comes out. I never thought of that. Is that kinda the same principle as what you were saying about laying in color by diluting it and rubbing it in until the conditioner starts to separate from it and wiping off the conditioner? That’s a detail I have never heard of before. That’s helpful. Really

Ugh. I forgot what you said about the color I’m the rest of this reply. I’m gonna post this and reply again.

Oh. I was saying before. I emailed that stylist this morning. This is what I told her.

“I’m still thinking about this. Considering my options. Which at the moment, doesn’t seem like very many. I had an idea, though I haven’t really thought it through yet....  Do you do extensions? And if so, what type and could you give me a quick menu of what those services cost? It might offer a much more preferable solution.

But, I’ve never had extensions except synthetic clip ins. I’ve read a lot about them. I know the basics. So, if I were to really think about this as an option somehow, I’ll have to figure out how to go about this. I need to figure out if my hair can handle the tension as well as whether or not I will be able to physically maintain them. Like, I’ve never understood how a person can properly brush their hair with extensions, and how the heck they sleep on them, and how much upkeep is required. And would I need to change how often, or what I use in my hair? I don’t know these things.

Maybe I can come up with completely different idea that would help both get me out of my current situation, let my hair “heal” without reinforcing the same issue on my virgin, not green hair. And also have SOME of what I want.

I think I really need to give my hair a “fresh start”. But I do NOT. Want my hair brown or red. I hate my natural hair color. And I’m starting to have a couple greys in my hair. Which will be great if they all go Grey FASTER. Duh. I’d love white hair. I’d change my hair colors every week. ?

I think I can come up with a “design” for my hair. And a couple of products that might help if I need to. I know this is being a ridiculously long process. But, I’m learning these things. I am a salon newb. Complete. And it’s not like I’m going anywhere else. Lol. We have time. I think the first thing I need to do is talk about extensions. And find out if the particular purple I have been using, fades to a green. I know some do. I didn’t think this one did. And I have been using it on my whole head. But, there are lots of places that aren’t green. It could be possible though that if it fades to green, it is sticking to the green left from the Ion Jade. and making that worse. ??? I’ll check that out.

Because even if it isn’t, if it fades to a green, I don’t want to use that product anymore. I do not want GREEN stuck in my hair ever again. It’s not my danged color. So, we will have to check with ANY future color we put on my head, to find out what color is fades to/what the base color is, whatever that is called. I’m not thinking too clear right now. Sorry. I haven’t been doing well this week. I’m having a fibromyalgia and arthritis flare up. Among other things it makes me super sleepy and gives me brain fog. But, I’ve been laying around, visualizing the whole problem. I still think we can figure this out. If you wanna keep talking this out, I think we can still do it or find a new thing to do instead. Meanwhile, I’m going to just be super nice to my hair. Masks. Oils. Some gentle clarifying shampoo. Try to fade it some more without putting anything harsh on it. (Do you think I should avoid purple shampoo or condition for now?)Gives me time to save up a few extra bucks, too. Depending on what I come up with, this may be even more expensive than I think. Might give my husband a panic attack. (He doesn’t really have those. Thankfully.  One of me is enough.) I’m gonna go look at some new inspiration things. And find out about the purple ive been using. I’ll get back with you. Tell me what you think.“

What do you think about me doing something with extensions? I do not know a lot about them. Would it be a better solution to do the CUT I want, except make BITH sides shorter, do the bangs/periwinkle, because I’ll have to look in mirror in a while, but I THINK I have enough root growth to bleach that out to virgin. Then, basically hack off most of the green/blonde with that high back, inverted asymmetrical bob. Then, put my regular or a non-fading to green purple back over everything that is not my bangs, either with the roots lightened OR not? Maybe. I have been looking at O.vertone products for a while. I was thinking maybe I could try THIER purple, over freshly lightened hair OR even try out the PURPLE FOR BROWN. I’ve been constantly on that site for months. I read every blog post, get their text messages, etc. I’m going to double check as soon as I’m done here. (Trying time stay focused this morning is difficult so I’m not going to look things up until I’m done here because I WILL get lost in the research for a couple hours and will forget to come back and post. Lol. It’s just a given.) Since their products are advertised as non-standing, buildable, easy to fade, etc...... and even have posts of people “going around the color wheel” with it. As well as the WAY the product is used... Maybe this product would be great for achieving my colors and not ending up with THIS MESS again? Thoughts?

Then, after the bangs are done, and the hair purpled (better) and the lengths cut off, maybe I could have her put RAINBOW colored extensions in, installed on the side I wanted to be longer.

I didn’t detail all that out to her yet, as I wanted to see if she even DOES extensions and what she can offer and more information than I have at this time about extensions, period. I don’t know if this is something I should even CONSIDER. But, it WOULD just be enough to add some length to the long side in colors, without having to go through stripping the color out of the length of my hair, and trying to do all that color correction.
Ugh. I don’t know.

Lastly, I hear you saying that I only need to actuall worry about the couple colors. So..... what if instead of those exact rainbow colors, yellow, etc..... I moved the color to less of that PRIMARY yellow, and made it peachy or orange sherbert, or something? It would still contrast, especially if I focused THOSE colors on peices that ARENT as green..... there ARE some much lighter and darker spots. If I could pick out the more blonde, and put the problematic colors on THOSE pieces, I’ll get a better, less muddy result, yeah? That seems logical to me.

Thank you for all of your help. At least I know I’m not just being the MOST STUBBORN PERSON in the world for not being willing to go “brown or red.”
Okay. I’m going to look up purples that go not-green. I know there’s several posts on here about that. As well as dig into O.vertone colors and look up information on the types of applications for extensions and what the difference methods will do to my head and how it will be trying to maintain them.

I’ll be back. Take your time replying. Like I told the stylist. I got the time, I’m not going anywhere. Though I am still leaning more to my own work over the salon route. I’ll mention to her the option of just completely bleaching me out and then, be willing to be my go to for all chemical touch ups. I think that’s a fair enough bargain. It IS MY HAIR, and not hers. And also, if I remember right, stylists have been making clients who want processing done on their hair, sign a waiver form, for decades, right? Or do they not still do that? To protect themselves if a clients hair falls off and stuff??

So on the topic of washing my hair, I'd say it usually takes me about 5-10 (depends a lot on the colours) washes in regular shampoo before I stop having substantial amounts of run-off when I shower. Then I switch over to the vitamin C/baking soda/dish soap mix, and that's usually another 5-10 (usually less than the regular shampoos though). My generally experience is that the vitamin C mix is kind of equivalent to 2-3 shampoos worth of fading, but I don't bring it in until the regular shampoo stops working. I think you could definitely do a shower-free approach, though. When I switch over the vitamin C mix, I actually do the initial rinsing and application just over a kitchen sink. While I'm letting it soak for 20+ minutes, I do some work or watch a show (hence why it sometimes goes up to 40 minutes) and then just hop into the shower to rinse it out. There's no reason you couldn't just do the second rinse over a sink as well to reduce your risk of slipping and help you keep most of your skin dry. I'm not sure if you have a sink that's a good height for you where you could sit to do it, but that would help as well. As for scraping off the extra foam, I actually learned about that on this forum years ago. Usually the initial foam will pull out a little bit of colour right away, so I scrape it off and add more to try and draw out more of the colour. I'm not 100% sure it's super helpful, but it's easy enough for me to do, so I don't mind it. Now to be clear, after my 5-10 rounds of regular shampoo and 5-10 rounds of vitamin C, it's not like my base is perfectly clean, but it's usually good enough for me to switch to another colour scheme. If you look in my timeline, this is process I've used between more of my colours, so you can see that I usually have to adapt my next colour scheme to what I had left over. I think if you did something similar like your suggesting of shifting the yellow to something more peachy and focusing it on lighter areas, it would work. I don't usually go for anything containing bleach unless I'm re-doing my roots (about 1-2 times a year) or if I really have something extremely specific in mind.

As for Overtone and similar products, I've found they are basically just less pigmented dyes. They do gradually shift the tone, but it's basically like applying a lot of layers of diluted dye over time. I have also heard that they are easy to fade as well, but I'm not sure if it's just because they don't have much colour to begin with and most people don't leave them as long as an actual dye. Uberliss is another option that claims to have bond-building type ingredients like Olaplex. I've honestly found them (bond builders, not Uberliss specifically) to be pretty unremarkable on my own hair, but I've definitely heard others that I know and trust say positive things, so I usually still recommend them for people who want to make sure they've tried everything. The purple I use that doesn't fade green is Punky Plum, but it's quite dark and definitely staining (it fades to pink), but I usually dilute it quite a bit (at least 1:2 dye to conditioner).

I'm not a huge help on extensions, because I've had short hair for most of my life, but my secondhand experience from my friends who work in salons is that micro-rings/links are just not great for your hair long-term. The weight of them can cause too much strain on the follicle and cause your hair to fall out and start thinning. There are plenty of salons out there who say "we do it safely, we make sure the extensions aren't too heavy," but the thing is, the safest way to do it also requires extremely regular touch-ups (monthly or more) where you have to move the rings up to compensate for how much your hair grows out, and most people can't afford that cost. I'm positive there are stories of people saying how they've done micro-rings for years and never had a problem, so I don't want to say this is absolutely what will happen to you, but I do feel like it's a common enough problem that people should know about it when they consider extensions. They also have other small annoyances like causing your hair to get more tangled as your hair sheds naturally but gets caught in the rings instead of just falling out as they normally would. Tape-in ones are a bit safer, and their major maintenance downside are related to not getting shampoo directly on the tape, which would be relatively easy for you. I'm not sure how easy they are to blend if you want to use them on the side of your head rather than the back, though. I'm sure there are loads of other little maintenance things you need to do, but I have no experience with them. If you want to go this route, I'd probably look for stylist who specialize in extensions, because they aren't necessarily the same people who are good at colour.

@vivienne

WOW. Okay. Not gonna make this super long. I’ve basically been told by the last of three or four stylists I contacted “Good Luck”. I get this is a lot to offer a stylist and they get worried about taking on a new client who seems to be so difficult to please. And maybe a little nuts. But, man, they are posting to Facebook BEGGING for clients right now due to Covid. I have offered to PAY SERIOUS DOUGH on this. Sigh. My husband said no more than $1500. More wouod have to be checked on and approved by him first. I would have thought someone would be willing. I went directly to the owners of each salon. And I chose the salons near me that had the BEST reviews, awards, licensed and certifications in various color specialities, and had the MOST and BEST crazy color “transformations”. They have all bowed out. Some not very nicely. I feel really bad that I seemed like so much of a problem that they said “No” for whatever reason. I hate when I make people feel bad. Or when I come off as difficult. Sigh. It also feels a little bad that despite my efforts to work with them, and let them know that I would pay well, tip well, and if they wished, stay their client, that I wanted the best they had, they still turned me down or refused to even attempt to work on my hair. That sucks. I do understand though. They really do have a job. I get how I can come off as a “nightmare client who hasn’t even scheduled an appt. and will be the topic of thier next “YouTube video”. And I know that they can probably make more on multiple clients in a day than one person, typically. But, dang. I asked the. How much thing would cost, to start AND at the upper end. I came up with several different methods of getting to a solution both me and the stylist were comfortable compromising on, asked for more ideas....... I don’t know WHAT I could have done MORE right. ??‍♀️ Sorry. I had to vent. That hurt my feelers a bit. But, I get it. They are businesses not friends.

So, looks like I am back to working on my own. With you. I have a plan forward. Based around research and everything I’ve gotten from you. But, I’m having really bad physical flare up right now. And I have to order some supplies. I will come back when I’m ready to move forward or have done something new to share results of. Thank you Vivienne!!! You are amazing. I can’t wait to try all of your tips. Soon as my FINGERS WILL WORK RIGHT AGAIN!!! Grrrrr. Lol.

It’s gonna take longer. But, IM NOT GIVING UP HERE. Meanwhile. I might as work on my hair timeline, eh? See you soon!!!

Best of luck Rainbeaux, I think that maybe the stylist were afraid to trigger more anxiety and/or have comunication issues midway. Don't be hard on yourself, you'll find a solution, be It the right stylist or the right technique to fix your hair!

I think @vivienne gave you the best advice. My contribution is surely not as helpful... but I just remembered that some users had great results with Joico color remover (apparently it's very effective on green and blues)... Have you tried it (or other brands of deposit dye removers)?

Thank you @stainrookie !!! (Great user name!) I DID try Joico. It really scares me and so .... I didn’t let it process as long as I should have. I have another packet. I may give it another try on a test strand.

I’m currently clipping my long strands into shorter pieces so that I have more to test on.

I’m thinking of going ahead and doing the hair CUT. I’m trying to figure out how to tie pieces together at the ends, so that when I do the CUT, I can use what I cut off as more test strands. ?

I WILL FIGURE THIS OUT.

I really don’t BLAME the stylists. I AM a difficult character. I know this. I tried. They tried. What more can be done?

But, man, I’m NOT giving up!!

All right. I have come to some decisions!!!!

But, FIRST!! I’m curious is anyone has tried this product and if so, what their experience has been with it.

Schwarzkopf Professional Bond Enforcing Color Remover

http://m.schwarzkopf-professionalusa.com/skp/us/en/home/products/color/color-remover.mobile.html

On this page, in the FAQ, it’s states

“ Can the Schwarzkopf Professional Bond Enforcing Color Remover be used to remove all types of color?- Yes, it can lift the build-up of most types of artificial pigments up to 3 levels.

I came across it because I’m looking at the Schwarzkopf BlondeMe line on their site, to make a list of what I’m about to buy on amazon and I want to make sure I get the whole system I need but nothing I don’t. If anyone has experience with this product, how did it work? (Should I make a new post for that question?)

Moving on. I have sat here for several days, okay. More than a week, kinda depressed and trying to glue these test strands together to make smaller pieces. I’ve got probably any adhesive on the market in my house and I’ve yet to find one to do this. But, quite frankly. I’m fed up.

So..... I’m not doing any more frikking dumb test strands.

I’m trying to be frikking PERFECT. The perfectionism is driving me crazy. Not my hair.

Therefore. Today. I am going to sit here and work on the hair that is on my head. If it all falls out, my wonderful ????‍♂️? will gladly buy me a human hair wig or some high quality extensions that I can dye to perfect colors and use until my hair grows back. I might even ask my amazing ????‍♂️? to buy them for me anyway.

Between that and that remaining items I need to purchase from amazon, it’s still going to be a buttload cheaper than going to any salon and getting anything remotely like what I want.

I’m going to create an amazon cart for those things today and try to get them purchased.

So, I’m just going to dive in. Starting with the least damaging treatments, over and over, until the amazon items arrive.

And each night I will pamper my hair with lots of love, conditioning masks, oils, etc. and sleep in it. The next day, I will wash it out, and continue.

I figure if I do it this way, it should be much lighter by the time my amazon stuff arrives.

The only question is if I’m going to try to pick through my hair to separate the green from the blonde.

I don’t know. Because really truthfully, according to all your wonderful advice, the only green I am going to NEED to fully remove is the little bits that are in what will be the longest parts of what will be my bangs and the ends of my hair. The purple will cover everything else.

After going back and watching my favorite LICENSED COSMETOLOGIST rainbow hair lover/doer DESTROY her hair MULTIPLE times, and knowing that I would never do what she did that caused that, and that the other methods she uses DONT cause that, I’m at the point that I’m just like ...“oh scr&w this! I ain’t scart.”

When it boils down to it, this STUFF is supposed to be FUN, right?

And nothing ever comes out perfect.

But, I have done plenty of screwed up stuff to my hair, and never RUINED it.

Not even the “freshly applied, and due to unforeseen events, HAD to get out 4 days later, smurf blue, 4xs bleached out, put red on it, turned it fraggle rock orange” incident, actually FRIED my hair. It DIDNT. And that was in 2002, with boxed bleach, and box garnier red, when I actually had NO CLUE what I was doing.

So, I dunno why I’m being such a big baby about this. So, I’m just...... diving in. I’m pretty sure you lovelies have given me enough advice that I can figure this out. I will keep y’all posted as I go.

And while I waiting for things to process, I’m going to actually work on my timeline. ??????